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Post by SoccerMom on Apr 24, 2018 23:44:46 GMT -5
The plan is for one team per club. The league is being viewed as just below DA, or if a club has DA and ECNL, just below them. But above Classic 1. Now will all the teams be better than every club in Classic 1? No. But if the new league pulls kids from other clubs then that will change. Hopefully all is clear by middle of next week. Also there was a mention earlier in this thread that the smaller clubs were going to counter with something. Curious about that as well. The counter is whats being discussed on the other thread. About not allowing them to be part of RPL/NL. The other clubs all got together and asked for this, and they voted on it yesterday.
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Post by surgesoccer on Apr 25, 2018 6:31:05 GMT -5
We'll see. A lot of unknowns right now but 30 days before decisions have to be made. So nothing to do but be patient and wait.
OR I guess you could freak out like they are in the other thread.
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Post by infoguy on Apr 25, 2018 7:43:27 GMT -5
Seems some feel that clubs with NPL would place their better teams in NPL first, then SCCL...?
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Post by SoccerMom on Apr 25, 2018 8:07:48 GMT -5
What i have been told is this will be the order:
DA ECNL NPL Champions League Everyone else Ga Soccer (Classic/Athena)
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Post by soccergurl on Apr 25, 2018 10:14:32 GMT -5
DA and ECNL are single club teams. Is that the same for NPL and champions league or can you have multiple location teams in the same league like Ga Soccer?
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Post by soccermaxx72 on Apr 25, 2018 10:38:04 GMT -5
What i have been told is this will be the order: DA ECNL NPL Champions League Everyone else Ga Soccer (Classic/Athena) So the Big 5 should really call their new league the "not so much" Champions League
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Post by SoccerMom on Apr 25, 2018 10:40:47 GMT -5
DA and ECNL are single club teams. Is that the same for NPL and champions league or can you have multiple location teams in the same league like Ga Soccer? The original idea was one team per club. The rest are supposed to play Select
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Post by SoccerMom on Apr 25, 2018 10:44:21 GMT -5
What i have been told is this will be the order: DA ECNL NPL Champions League Everyone else Ga Soccer (Classic/Athena) So the Big 5 should really call their new league the "not so much" Champions League Lol, lets just call it a giant cluster! I remember when my oldest started select and I had to learn all about RPL and NL and how confusing it all was. Now i think back and it was nothing compared to now. Its easier for us to understand this a little better since we are stuck in the middle of it, but brand new parents are going to need a handbook
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Post by Soccerhouse on Apr 25, 2018 11:17:05 GMT -5
Its mess for sure -- what complicates and makes matters worse, is different clubs have different things.
I remember trying to explain DA and Georgia United to folks back in the day, it required a few hours of someones time! Then explaining ECNL to a parent with a 9 year old daughter, "but wait our club doesn't have ECNL" Then the questions about ODP.
Its confusing as heck for the parent of a u9 that is naive to the reality of youth soccer. Historically it was ok to be naive, as you didn't have to worry about these things for years, thats no longer the case -- Age mandates, have fall birthdays essentially playing an age group older sooner, so things are happening faster. I saw a tweet from one of the mls clubs, bragging about a u10 2008 playing u12 DA. We have atlanta id sessions for 8 and 9 year olds. Just saying a few years ago, you had time to figure this all out, not as much anymore!
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Post by surgesoccer on Apr 25, 2018 11:43:58 GMT -5
I've never thought about the leagues associated with USYS and US Club. But looking at the two websites here is what I see for U13 and above. Correct me where wrong or misguided:
US SOCCER: DA
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US YOUTH SOCCER:
National League: The US Youth Soccer National League competition is for the nation's top teams in the 14U, 15U, 16U, 17U and 18U boys and girls age groups. The 14U and 15U divisions consist of a total of 16 teams per gender age group, while the 16U through 18U gender age groups feature 32 teams each. The National League offers additional exposure to collegiate, professional and U.S. National Team coaches and offers the highest level of competition in the country as each team must earn their place in the league. National League teams continue play in their respective US Youth Soccer Regional Leagues and State Championships to complete their competitive calendar. Teams play a seven-game schedule over two weekends, facing each team within its age group division one time. The League consists of three weekends of play per gender, with each team playing two of the three weekends.
The top teams from each division advance to the US Youth Soccer National Championships, the oldest and most prestigious youth soccer national championship in the country. The four National League representatives will join the four Regional Champions in the 14U through 18U age groups to play for the National Championship. The top teams in each 14U through 17U division also secure a spot to return to National League play the following season.
Regional Leagues The US Youth Soccer Premier Leagues provide an opportunity for the most competitive teams in each region to play each other on a scheduled basis while also competing for placement in the prestigious US Youth Soccer Regional Championships, as well as the highly-competitive US Youth Soccer National League. Champions of the Regional Leagues will move on to their respective Regional Championships, the second stage of the US Youth Soccer National Championship Series, with hopes of advancing to the US Youth Soccer National Championships, the oldest and most prestigious national soccer tournament in the country. Additionally, the Regional League premier division champions earn qualification for the following year’s US Youth Soccer National League. The National League competition is for the nation's top teams in the 14U through 18U boys and girls age groups. The National League offers additional exposure to collegiate, professional and U.S. National Team coaches and offers the highest level of competition in the country as each team must earn their place in the league. In each gender age group, the top two teams from each division advance to the US Youth Soccer National Championships.
Athena/Classic Georgia Soccer managed league with 5 divisions from Classic 1 to Classic 5. Promotion to Regional League for top teams.
ODP Managed by Georgia Soccer and provides extra training throughout year and a tournament or two. Chance for players to be selected for regional teams, camps, etc.
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US CLUB SOCCER
ENPL US Club Soccer and the Elite Clubs National League are collaborating to create a new national competition and development platform for 14-U through 18/19-U boys beginning in August 2017. The Elite National Premier League (ENPL) will provide local and national regular-season competition, national showcase events and postseason playoff competition for top teams across the country.
The ENPL will include both member Elite Clubs National League conferences (ECNL conferences) and member National Premier Leagues (NPLs), providing multiple entry paths into the competition. ENPL competition will include 14-U, 15-U, 16-U, 17-U and 19-U boys age groups, and will include participating teams from two independent qualification paths: (i) qualifying teams from designated National Premier Leagues across the country; and (ii) qualifying teams from ECNL club-based conferences across the country. These teams will come together to compete for the ENPL National Championship in a two-stage postseason event in 2018.
NPL The NPL was created to elevate and change the competitive youth soccer landscape by extending developmental principles espoused by U.S. Soccer into more age groups and clubs, by linking competition with player development and identification platforms, and by providing meaningful weekly competition culminating in the NPL Finals.
NPLs are independent leagues, unified under one national competition platform, and based on a common technical framework designed to improve long-term player development. Includes showcases and a national tournament.
ECNL The Elite Clubs National League was founded to improve the daily environment for youth soccer players through a collaborative club-based development program featuring competition, player identification, and coaching and club development platforms. ECNL will include both regular season conference games and cross-conference events, and qualifying teams from the ECNL will advance to the post-season Elite National Premier League (ENPL) Playoffs.
Premier Leagues Building on the success of the National Premier Leagues (NPL) and the principle that league-based competition is the primary means for long-term player development and growth of the game, US Club Soccer has created the Premier Leagues platform, a network of leagues in local, statewide and similar geographic regions for competitive clubs and teams.
Premier Leagues are created with similar philosophies as the NPL, as well as the U.S. Soccer Developmental Academy and Elite Clubs National League (ECNL), but with unique structures for participating clubs and teams.
While US Club Soccer’s emphasis on club development led to a club-based structure for the NPL, one of the differentiating factors in the Premier Leagues platform is the allowance for more team-based competition due to the smaller geographic region that each league covers (for example, no overnight stays are necessary). In areas with existing NPLs, the new Premier Leagues platform will extend opportunities to more clubs.
In addition to competing for league championships, qualifiers from each Premier League will meet for a Regional Premier Leagues Championship in future years, eventually culminating in a Premier Leagues national championship event. Qualification paths will be based on the number of leagues, regional travel logistics and calendar considerations.
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So seems to me what the Big 5 are creating is a Premier League. I assume the goal was to have 1 team from each club at each age group compete. Remaining teams in the club would then compete in Athena/Classic.
Not sure why other clubs have such a problem with this other than their Ego's were hurt because they were not invited. As for Georgia soccer, while top kids at the Big 5 would no longer be playing under the GA Soccer umbrella, they would still have a lot of Athena/Classic kids, and Rec kids under it. And if I understand it correctly, they get money for each player being registered with them.
So for UFA there would be 6 age groups * 2 (boys/girls), which is 12 teams with 18 kids on each team. That's 216 players. So over 5 clubs you're looking at about 1,000 kids.
At UFA I have to think that there are probably 500-700 kids that would still be in Athena/Classic, and another 3000-5000 in Rec. If you combine the top 5 clubs you're probably talking about 20,000 additional kids.
Did Georgia Soccer really allow themselves to be pushed into kicking out these clubs and giving up the revenue from 20,000 kids over 1,000? And over the smaller clubs feelings being hurt?
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I have to be missing something here because this would not make sense. Tell me where I'm getting this wrong.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Apr 25, 2018 11:54:01 GMT -5
I don't know for sure --- but once they brought NPL into hierarchy, does it make sense having teams below that level traveling for RPL? probably not given the issues that have been discussed and the reason for the move as well.
the new national league/rpl format does throw a wrench in the equation, my guess is so much work was done to create a year around npl league and the new league that the new changes for rpl came to late.
I just like state cup/regionals/nationals etc -- playing for something, playing for a title your team earns on the field etc. But I'm old school, and unfortunately those days are long gone. (granted even Carleton said last summer for the world cup was the first time he played a meaningful game - I might be wrong on the quote, haven't had time to dig it up)
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Post by soccerspin on Apr 25, 2018 13:02:41 GMT -5
New to all of this and my head is spinning. I didn’t want to quote the entire portion of an earlier comment (too long) so here’s my cut and paste of what I wanted to comment on:
“Not sure why other clubs have such a problem with this other than their Ego's were hurt because they were not invited”
Again I’m very new to all of this but given I am at a smaller club the way I see it is the bigger ones are diluting the competitive pool (again) for GA Soccer. So they continue the squeeze on the smaller clubs to cough up what’s left of their strong players because those strong players are continuing to see the better competitions being played elsewhere. And the smaller clubs cannot compete because they’ll never be deep enough to field teams in these specialized leagues. Is that anywhere close to being accurate or am I missing something?
(And a BIG thanks to all of you for these discussions! Learning a tremendous amount! (Although wish it wasn’t this complicated))
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Post by surgesoccer on Apr 25, 2018 14:28:35 GMT -5
Don't disagree that part of the thinking here could be that it is a marketing opportunity to draw in new players. The top 5 all added DA teams from u12 - u14. That was a drain on talent available at the Classic level. This year in U13 Classic 1 you have some very competitive teams that are not part of the top 5:
GA Rush, GA Storm, KSA, Roswell, MOBA, Athens, Steamers are all very competitive. The Top 5 when the season ends will probably not have a team in the top 3 or 4. The Top 5 teams have had to regroup and try to fill holes while the non-DA clubs have continued on without having the same issue.
So the big clubs like to recruit from the smaller clubs. Those clubs, though like to poach players from clubs smaller than they are. Its just how it is. Its up to each club to do what it needs to, to keep its players.
Is recruiting the primary reason for the new league. I doubt it but it does factor in.
And I agree it is too complicated.
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Post by ga3v3 on Apr 25, 2018 20:01:23 GMT -5
No way this league will be higher than classic 1- possibly in line or slightly lower. I’d predict around tryout time many of the big 5s classic 1 players will be looking for a club that still competes in c1 or aA with a chance at real promotion rather than competing against the same teams in an academy style setting. Looks like some of the small or medium sized clubs will be getting bigger
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Post by soccerdaddy on Apr 25, 2018 20:43:25 GMT -5
No way this league will be higher than classic 1- possibly in line or slightly lower. I’d predict around tryout time many of the big 5s classic 1 players will be looking for a club that still competes in c1 or aA with a chance at real promotion rather than competing against the same teams in an academy style setting. Looks like some of the small or medium sized clubs will be getting bigger I don’t think so, unless they can offer DA or ECNL. Sorry, I think more players will keep trying to play in one of those and if the can’t will play on that 2nd team for the club that offers either of the two. My opinion, as that’s exactly what the big 5 have that GA Soccer can’t offer.
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Post by dad on Apr 25, 2018 20:55:09 GMT -5
Expect an announcement in early June. Why any earlier?
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Post by dad on Apr 25, 2018 21:01:24 GMT -5
But do not panic. Nothing so see here. Just keep moving and wait for official announcement before looking for a SRPL team to tryout for. Everything is fine. The sky is not falling.
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Post by oraclesfriend on Apr 25, 2018 21:07:42 GMT -5
No way this league will be higher than classic 1- possibly in line or slightly lower. I’d predict around tryout time many of the big 5s classic 1 players will be looking for a club that still competes in c1 or aA with a chance at real promotion rather than competing against the same teams in an academy style setting. Looks like some of the small or medium sized clubs will be getting bigger I don’t think so, unless they can offer DA or ECNL. Sorry, I think more players will keep trying to play in one of those and if the can’t will play on that 2nd team for the club that offers either of the two. My opinion, as that’s exactly what the big 5 have that GA Soccer can’t offer. It really all depends on the kids, parents and clubs available. I still think parents should pay more attention to the coach than what level they are playing when they are close. I think some will come to the big 5 to have a chance at DA and or ECNL as guest players or DP even if they don't make the initial team and some would rather have the chance for promotion and relegation. The one thing I noticed when I looked around is this isn't just a Georgia thing. Florida has their US club soccer run Florida Premier League. We have seen Soccermom post a Carolina academy age version. We have heard someone say there was a version in Virginia. We just have to wait and see how it plays out. No way to predict what will happen. I have reservations about the idea but I just want to hear more details.
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Post by oraclesfriend on Apr 25, 2018 21:27:43 GMT -5
Nobody should care about any specific team’s “real promotion” in an irrelevant league that resides halfway between DA and rec. Those days are long gone. Today’s player is working to be individually promoted to the highest level team possible. That’s just the way it is. This is very true that today's player is looking for individual promotion. That is why there is so much club hopping to get on a "top" team etc. I don't know that nobody "should care" because I think there are a lot of kids that are not DA and are far from rec that are still just trying to get better. I think they should care about whether they have the right coach more than the right level of team just to say "I am on RPL or I am on ECNL". They also should care about their playing time. I know a lot of kids that are on ECNL and RPL teams at U13 that are getting less than 10 minutes per game. Hard to improve a lot that way.
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Post by footy on Apr 25, 2018 22:15:25 GMT -5
Cherokee Impact posted this on Facebook tonight:
Cherokee Impact along with 40 other clubs formed a Georgia Club Alliance several months ago. This Alliance countered the intent of 6 clubs in Georgia (UFA, Concorde, NTH, GSA, AFU and SSA) to start a new league in direct opposition of the existing SRPL/RPL or NL and outside of Georgia Soccer and our governing body USYSA. Two nights ago in the Georgia Soccer Board meeting, the start to our goal for leveling the playing field among clubs in Georgia was successfully realized. The Board passed our exact measure to hold the National League (formerly known as SRPL/RPL) open to Georgia Soccer loyal clubs only and exclude from the National League any club that chooses to play in a non-sanctioned league, namely ECNL and the newly formed Southeast Eastern Champions League. This means that only players in our clubs can be recognized to be selected to participate in the National League. This is a huge, historic victory for all clubs in Georgia and ensures the continued strength and integrity of our leagues and the National League qualification process. Additionally, all teams that qualify for the National League do so by playing and competing under the same rules.
We are very excited with this new direction and purpose for Georgia Soccer. Under new proven leadership, National League players will see a more stream-lined organization with an age group appropriate focus, higher facility standards and more cost efficient travel schedules, among other new changes. We believe our new National League will soon be recognized as one of premiere leagues in the country.
More information will follow these upcoming days and weeks, but we wanted to keep you informed on the latest developments.
Sincerely,
Shane Moore - Executive Director Alex Pama - Technical Director Robert Roddie - Director of the Girls Program Matt Burleson - Director of the Boys Program
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Post by soccerdaddy on Apr 25, 2018 23:35:46 GMT -5
Cherokee Impact posted this on Facebook tonight: Cherokee Impact along with 40 other clubs formed a Georgia Club Alliance several months ago. This Alliance countered the intent of 6 clubs in Georgia (UFA, Concorde, NTH, GSA, AFU and SSA) to start a new league in direct opposition of the existing SRPL/RPL or NL and outside of Georgia Soccer and our governing body USYSA. Two nights ago in the Georgia Soccer Board meeting, the start to our goal for leveling the playing field among clubs in Georgia was successfully realized. The Board passed our exact measure to hold the National League (formerly known as SRPL/RPL) open to Georgia Soccer loyal clubs only and exclude from the National League any club that chooses to play in a non-sanctioned league, namely ECNL and the newly formed Southeast Eastern Champions League. This means that only players in our clubs can be recognized to be selected to participate in the National League. This is a huge, historic victory for all clubs in Georgia and ensures the continued strength and integrity of our leagues and the National League qualification process. Additionally, all teams that qualify for the National League do so by playing and competing under the same rules. We are very excited with this new direction and purpose for Georgia Soccer. Under new proven leadership, National League players will see a more stream-lined organization with an age group appropriate focus, higher facility standards and more cost efficient travel schedules, among other new changes. We believe our new National League will soon be recognized as one of premiere leagues in the country. More information will follow these upcoming days and weeks, but we wanted to keep you informed on the latest developments. Sincerely, Shane Moore - Executive Director Alex Pama - Technical Director Robert Roddie - Director of the Girls Program Matt Burleson - Director of the Boys Program How many teams do they have in National League? I see the 04 Boys are in RPL but no other teams that I see? No wonder they are for this because with this change it will allow more teams from Impact to have a better chance to try to get to NL. This is a good thing for Impact.
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Post by soccerdaddy on Apr 25, 2018 23:37:56 GMT -5
Also, I just noticed AFU is in it as well. What’s up with that?
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Post by SoccerMom on Apr 26, 2018 5:57:25 GMT -5
AFU has ECNL and they're directly affected. Not part of the Champions League, but that may have to change
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Post by infoguy on Apr 26, 2018 7:05:32 GMT -5
I believe in moving on in life, but I don't know why GA Soccer is raising such a stink (granted, it's a money thing too), because I have no evidence that they leaned hard on SRPL over the past 2 years, when the administration of the league was just plain abysmal. I wouldn't want the job of SRPL scheduler, but obviously other leagues are run far better and I assume the communication at least with team managers are far superior to what I experienced personally as a TM one year. Harsh, I know, but they are reaping what they sowed.
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Post by ga3v3 on Apr 26, 2018 10:12:38 GMT -5
No way this league will be higher than classic 1- possibly in line or slightly lower. I’d predict around tryout time many of the big 5s classic 1 players will be looking for a club that still competes in c1 or aA with a chance at real promotion rather than competing against the same teams in an academy style setting. Looks like some of the small or medium sized clubs will be getting bigger I don’t think so, unless they can offer DA or ECNL. Sorry, I think more players will keep trying to play in one of those and if the can’t will play on that 2nd team for the club that offers either of the two. My opinion, as that’s exactly what the big 5 have that GA Soccer can’t offer. Unfortunately for those kids they will rarely, if ever see a promotion. Those teams will typically recruit stronger players from other clubs to fill the top teams roster.
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Post by ga3v3 on Apr 26, 2018 10:33:55 GMT -5
Nobody should care about any specific team’s “real promotion” in an irrelevant league that resides halfway between DA and rec. Those days are long gone. Today’s player is working to be individually promoted to the highest level team possible. That’s just the way it is. You're correct about the top level players(parents) that are chasing the top teams and don't care about being on a team that has to earn their spot instead of paying for it. Good for them and US Soccer. I just can't see why players(parents) who aren't at a DA level would choose to play on a Big 5s 2nd or 3rd team in NPL or a 3rd/4th team in the SCCL, which in reality sounds more like it will be a CL2 academy style league and well below the Piedmont Conference or the NL. Good luck to the clubs trying to sell that one...should be interesting
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Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2018 10:35:56 GMT -5
AFU has ECNL and they're directly affected. Not part of the Champions League, but that may have to change AFU was one of the original two clubs who began the discussion of the SCCL 15 months ago. But they since pulled out because of the changes USYSA did. 1) Better travel conditions. The new region will have SC, NC, North Ga toegether. When a Ga tean plays a NC team, the two teams will meet at CESA in order to cut costs.......this is good for the kid and parent; 2) There will be an anouncement soon that Ga Soccer and USYSA will offer College Combines vs the College Showcases. This is better for the kids. Think of the NFL draft combines. College coaches will hold a three day combine where they look at each kid individually measuring their speed, passing, dribble speed, tactics, etc. Compare this with a "showcase"....if your kid is playing with a weak player, your kid may not shine because of the weak link. Under the Combine, each players' strengths are specifically measured. On another note, the two DA clubs with ECNL teams (TH and CF) will lose one of them. They won't tell their members yet because they want to get them signed up. But either 2018 or 2019, they will have to choose. Therefore, you will have many quality players leave those two clubs because they don't make the DA or ECNL top team. They will look at AFU/GSA ECNL, making those two clubs stronger. One ECNL slot will go to CESA. The other is up in the air.
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Post by Soccerhouse on Apr 26, 2018 10:39:54 GMT -5
AFU has ECNL and they're directly affected. Not part of the Champions League, but that may have to change AFU was one of the original two clubs who began the discussion of the SCCL 15 months ago. But they since pulled out because of the changes USYSA did. 1) Better travel conditions. The new region will have SC, NC, North Ga toegether. When a Ga tean plays a NC team, the two teams will meet at CESA in order to cut costs.......this is good for the kid and parent; 2) There will be an anouncement soon that Ga Soccer and USYSA will offer College Combines vs the College Showcases. This is better for the kids. Think of the NFL draft combines. College coaches will hold a three day combine where they look at each kid individually measuring their speed, passing, dribble speed, tactics, etc. Compare this with a "showcase"....if your kid is playing with a weak player, your kid may not shine because of the weak link. Under the Combine, each players' strengths are specifically measured. On another note, the two DA clubs with ECNL teams (TH and CF) will lose one of them. They won't tell their members yet because they want to get them signed up. But either 2018 or 2019, they will have to choose. Therefore, you will have many quality players leave those two clubs because they don't make the DA or ECNL top team. They will look at AFU/GSA ECNL, making those two clubs stronger. One ECNL slot will go to CESA. The other is up in the air. What was the comment about? One ECNL slot will go to CESA. The other is up in the air?
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Post by soccerdaddy on Apr 26, 2018 11:28:53 GMT -5
I don’t think so, unless they can offer DA or ECNL. Sorry, I think more players will keep trying to play in one of those and if the can’t will play on that 2nd team for the club that offers either of the two. My opinion, as that’s exactly what the big 5 have that GA Soccer can’t offer. Unfortunately for those kids they will rarely, if ever see a promotion. Those teams will typically recruit stronger players from other clubs to fill the top teams roster. I still think that the majority of players/parents will be the ones making the contact to those clubs without recruiting. Is your definition of recruiting having DA/ECNL ID sessions during the end of the season? If yes, then I agree and yes those clubs want the best possible players to fill those rosters. That’s why it will continue to be the most competitive leagues.
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Post by SoccerMom on Apr 26, 2018 13:29:48 GMT -5
AFU has ECNL and they're directly affected. Not part of the Champions League, but that may have to change AFU was one of the original two clubs who began the discussion of the SCCL 15 months ago. But they since pulled out because of the changes USYSA did. 1) Better travel conditions. The new region will have SC, NC, North Ga toegether. When a Ga tean plays a NC team, the two teams will meet at CESA in order to cut costs.......this is good for the kid and parent; 2) There will be an anouncement soon that Ga Soccer and USYSA will offer College Combines vs the College Showcases. This is better for the kids. Think of the NFL draft combines. College coaches will hold a three day combine where they look at each kid individually measuring their speed, passing, dribble speed, tactics, etc. Compare this with a "showcase"....if your kid is playing with a weak player, your kid may not shine because of the weak link. Under the Combine, each players' strengths are specifically measured. On another note, the two DA clubs with ECNL teams (TH and CF) will lose one of them. They won't tell their members yet because they want to get them signed up. But either 2018 or 2019, they will have to choose. Therefore, you will have many quality players leave those two clubs because they don't make the DA or ECNL top team. They will look at AFU/GSA ECNL, making those two clubs stronger. One ECNL slot will go to CESA. The other is up in the air. AFU cannot play in the new RPL league because they have ECNL. And CESA has ECNL already... And AFU didnt leave....they were uninvited...
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